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 Post subject: War On Drugs
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:14 pm 
Snarf

Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:12 pm
Posts: 18
According to the State Department's annual drug-trafficking report, a federal law took effect in 1985 authorizing the United States to penalize countries that do not control illicit narcotics production. Today, these same countries are now producing larger quantities of heroin, cocaine, marijuana and other drugs, Furthermore, three years after installing a pro-U.S. government, Afghanistan has been unable to contain opium poppy production and is on the verge of becoming a narcotics state. Opium poppy is the raw material for heroin. Colombia is the source of more than 90 percent of the cocaine and 50 percent of the heroin entering the United States. The report also listed Mexico as a major producer of heroin, methamphetamine and marijuana destined for U.S. markets. Source: New York Times and Associated Press.

Some would argue that the only solution would be the legalization of drugs. By removing the criminality of drug sales, possession and usage, the United States government could devote more of its law enforcement resources on other crimes such as murder, rape, assault etc. Furthermore, they argue that regulation of such drugs could create a revenue enhancement for federal, state and local governments. The counter argument suggests that by legalizing drugs, the government grants an implicit consent that drug consumption is morally acceptable. Others argue that the U.S. should focus more on the demand side of the problem by increasing funds for psychiatric and psychological counseling. Their argument is based on the idea that if the individual is properly counseled and medicated, the demand for illegal narcotics would drop significantly. The counter argument is that this solution is cost prohibitive and will only result in replacing one problem with another. Still others offer a more hard-line approach when it comes to dealing with foreign countries such as setting a deadline for the removal of narcotics production. If the deadline passes, the U.S. should utilize various crop-field-burning methods so as to totally obliterate any type of crop production. This would effectively eliminate the central piece of drug production across the planet. The counter argument, however, is that this policy would prevent farmers from switching to other crops in order to earn a legitimate living. I believe that the problem of illegal narcotics in the United States poses a greater threat to the average citizen than any terrorist and/or nuclear threat in existence today. Perhaps a balanced integration of all three of these solutions is our only answer.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:26 am 
Godzilla
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hey, it's not like the prohibition helped make a bunch of criminals rich or anything. AND it stopped all those people from drinking, all because of one woman who was sick of her alcoholic husband. The politicians who passed it still drank, btw.

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"The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other... involves orcs."
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 Post subject: Re: War On Drugs
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 1:47 pm 
Mechagodzilla
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Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 9:57 pm
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JOEBIALEK wrote:

Still others offer a more hard-line approach when it comes to dealing with foreign countries such as setting a deadline for the removal of narcotics production. If the deadline passes, the U.S. should utilize various crop-field-burning methods so as to totally obliterate any type of crop production. This would effectively eliminate the central piece of drug production across the planet.

OK big guy...the US already does this and has for probably over 3 decades...it doesn't work if it were that easy, do you think people would still be growing pot in the US? When is the last time you were hurt by a drug dealer? yeah, I thought so. drugs are not endangering anyone any more than terrorism...ooohhhhhhhhh terrorism which by the way is only a threat to politicians and people in high profile positions and places. nice propaganda though. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: War On Drugs
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 1:57 pm 
Godzilla
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Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2003 1:10 pm
Posts: 6351
Ramirez wrote:
JOEBIALEK wrote:

Still others offer a more hard-line approach when it comes to dealing with foreign countries such as setting a deadline for the removal of narcotics production. If the deadline passes, the U.S. should utilize various crop-field-burning methods so as to totally obliterate any type of crop production. This would effectively eliminate the central piece of drug production across the planet.

OK big guy...the US already does this and has for probably over 3 decades...it doesn't work if it were that easy, do you think people would still be growing pot in the US? When is the last time you were hurt by a drug dealer? yeah, I thought so. drugs are not endangering anyone any more than terrorism...ooohhhhhhhhh terrorism which by the way is only a threat to politicians and people in high profile positions and places. nice propaganda though. :wink:


Drug Prohibition creates a vast black market, with a concomitant 10,000x (not an exaggeration) increase in the profitability of the "prohibited" substances. Thus supporting the "War on Some Drugs" does nothing but funnel enormous profits to criminal/terrorist organizations, while imprisoning wide swaths of the population, most of which are the poor and minorities.

additonal reading:

economic:

http://www.project-syndicate.org/series ... 856&lang=1
http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?control=959&id=78
http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?control=828&id=78


Milton Friedman

http://www.druglibrary.org/special/frie ... ialist.htm
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Misc/friedm1.htm

William F Buckley

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/wfbu ... 0129.shtml
http://www-cgi.cnn.com/US/9601/legalize_drugs/

Gary Becker

http://www.becker-posner-blog.com/archi ... re_of.html

Richard Posner

http://www.becker-posner-blog.com/archi ... _drug.html


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 3:25 pm 
Mothra

Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 11:56 am
Posts: 121
Location: Planet Earth
Oh, Gawd. They've been arguing about this for how many years now?
For what it's worth, I agree that Prohibition invented organized crime. It made a lot of people wealthy. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

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Does the government fear us? Or do we fear the government? When the people fear the government, tyranny has found victory. The federal government is our servant, not our master. - Thomas Jefferson


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 5:48 pm 
Godzilla
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BASSClarke wrote:
Oh, Gawd. They've been arguing about this for how many years now?
For what it's worth, I agree that Prohibition invented organized crime. It made a lot of people wealthy. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

it did not invent it - organized crime is very old. It sure helped it become very powerful though.

_________________
"The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other... involves orcs."
- Kung Fu Monkey


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 7:25 pm 
unpossibles wrote:
hey, it's not like the prohibition helped make a bunch of criminals rich or anything. AND it stopped all those people from drinking, all because of one woman who was sick of her alcoholic husband. The politicians who passed it still drank, btw.


For some odd reason, I am having some kind of weird deja vu experience lately....
I wonder why........

Must be the bathub gin I am stocking up on.


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 Post subject: replies
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 8:49 pm 
Snarf

Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:12 pm
Posts: 18
some excellent points and analysis...illegal narcotics are a symptom of our country imploding (addiction) as compared to exploding (terrorists)...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2005 2:59 am 
Jet Jaguar
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Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:19 am
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Drugs are pretty cool.


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 Post subject: Re: War On Drugs
PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2005 7:26 pm 
King Ghidorah
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Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2003 10:48 am
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JOEBIALEK wrote:
The counter argument suggests that by legalizing drugs, the government grants an implicit consent that drug consumption is morally acceptable.


Why should drug consumption be morally unacceptable?! There's nothing immoral about taking drugs.

By making drugs legal not only would police not have to worry about enforcing drug laws, they wouldn't have to worry about the copious amounts of other related crimes, specifically the murders that take place as a result of disputes over dealer territory, due to money owed, etc.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2005 10:31 am 
Godzilla
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Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 4:14 pm
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Location: Columbus, Ohio
We would all have to worry about getting high off pot smoke at Little Brother's though.

Damn, I really am going to have to seal off my house with duct tape.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 5:46 pm 
Godzilla
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Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2003 1:02 pm
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Location: The After Dark Peach Pit
corggirl wrote:
We would all have to worry about getting high off pot smoke at Little Brother's though.


Except you... can't smoke at Little Brother's.

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 Post subject: Re: War On Drugs
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:12 pm 
Mothra

Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 5:27 pm
Posts: 61
Location: c-bus
DJ Sleepy wrote:
JOEBIALEK wrote:
The counter argument suggests that by legalizing drugs, the government grants an implicit consent that drug consumption is morally acceptable.


Why should drug consumption be morally unacceptable?! There's nothing immoral about taking drugs.

By making drugs legal not only would police not have to worry about enforcing drug laws, they wouldn't have to worry about the copious amounts of other related crimes, specifically the murders that take place as a result of disputes over dealer territory, due to money owed, etc.


very excellent point and I'll further it by asking, whether moral or not, is it the government's responsibility to attempt to legislate morality. And if so, who's morality should they legislate?

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