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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 11:20 am 
King Ghidorah
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couldn't we just try and do something different and have like an ATV version of a streetcar, that uses the bike trails instead of high street? that way, in the event of heavy bike/dog traffic, it could just cruise the olentangy instead.

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This was my one and only 2012 proposal, and I was greatly dissapointed in the lack of vision among those in attendance.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 11:28 am 
Godzilla
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If you guys got a Chitty Chitty Bang Bang ATV bike trail trolley, I would totally move back to C-Bus.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 11:32 am 
Godzilla
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annie oakley wrote:
If you guys got a Chitty Chitty Bang Bang ATV bike trail trolley, I would totally move back to C-Bus.


Once they replace the flouride in the water with PCP, there should be no problem passing this proposal.
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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:16 pm 
Donewaiting.com Staff
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I do sort of like the riverboat idea. as long as you could gamble.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:18 pm 
Godzilla
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groundrules wrote:
I do sort of like the riverboat idea. as long as you could gamble.

what about streetcar casinos? a win-win situation?

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:51 pm 
Godzilla

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PinheadFestival wrote:
Cookie wrote:
PinheadFestival wrote:
They're not cutting down the lanes on High Street, the streetcar shares lanes with traffic.


I'll admit that I don't know much about streetcars, but isn't that unusual?


Nope, the modern version (non trolley) almost always shares the roadway with cars.


High Street is bad enough during rush hour now. How is it supposed to help when the streetcar is blocking one of the car lanes? Mayor Coleman can not be bothered with this tiny little issues that get in the way of his ideas.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:56 pm 
Godzilla

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Also, are we going to get to look forward to seeing a bunch of lovely wires and cables hanging above High Street?

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:59 pm 
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bnb614 wrote:
High Street is bad enough during rush hour now. How is it supposed to help when the streetcar is blocking one of the car lanes? Mayor Coleman can not be bothered with this tiny little issues that get in the way of his ideas.


High street during rush hour already has one lane blocked for public transit.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:05 pm 
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groundrules wrote:
High street during rush hour already has one lane blocked for public transit.


Yes, but this one will be awesome.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:09 pm 
Godzilla
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This is what they are proposing in Cincinnati.

Image

Now, if they can find a way to fit it in Downtown here, it should be no problem in Columbus. High Street Itself is like Race and Vine put together as far as width is concerned. The street are very narrow down here.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:12 pm 
King Ghidorah

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bnb614 wrote:
High Street is bad enough during rush hour now. How is it supposed to help when the streetcar is blocking one of the car lanes? Mayor Coleman can not be bothered with this tiny little issues that get in the way of his ideas.


What part of "engineering phase" aren't you getting yet? That's exactly what they're determining right now.

p.s. I'm pretty sure buses stop along High St. right now as it is.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:16 pm 
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PinheadFestival wrote:
What part of "engineering phase" aren't you getting yet?


Probably the "engineering" part. That sounds hard.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:18 pm 
Godzilla
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Jesus Pinhead, do you have to be so condescedning and patronizing?

I agree with your stance on this issue, but you make it hard. You persuade more people when you don't act like a complete butthead.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:20 pm 
King Ghidorah
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annie oakley wrote:
This is what they are proposing in Cincinnati.

Image

Now, if they can find a way to fit it in Downtown here, it should be no problem in Columbus. High Street Itself is like Race and Vine put together as far as width is concerned. The street are very narrow down here.



look, I know I'm not the smartest guy in the world or anything, but I'm not a complete idiot, either. would someone, anyone, please explain what the difference is between this thing and a fucking bus? I still haven't heard that.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:23 pm 
King Ghidorah

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LOL...fair enough, but I simply met snarkiness with snarkiness, IMO.

Regardless, yeah. Right now, this is NOT a done deal. They are putting a couple million bucks into engineering the project to figure out exactly how it's going to be most effective, not hurt business along the line during construction, interact with busing, etc.

Some lines run down the middle of the street, for example, some run along the curb. The number 2 may be moved or may stay, those are all the kinds of things that the engineering study is going to come up with before it goes to Council for approval on the funding proposal.

and yeah Tux, they have. One is an economic initiative and a step towards modern public transportation...one isn't. Buses, no matter how amazing the system might be short of BRT, don't drive economic development...light rail does.

p.s. As I said earlier, COTA is getting a HUGE surge in funding this month that will enable them to almost double their hours. This isn't an "either or" deal.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:27 pm 
Godzilla

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tuxspeedo wrote:
annie oakley wrote:
This is what they are proposing in Cincinnati.

Image

Now, if they can find a way to fit it in Downtown here, it should be no problem in Columbus. High Street Itself is like Race and Vine put together as far as width is concerned. The street are very narrow down here.



look, I know I'm not the smartest guy in the world or anything, but I'm not a complete idiot, either. would someone, anyone, please explain what the difference is between this thing and a fucking bus? I still haven't heard that.


Busses aren't hip and don't piss away $100,000,000.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:28 pm 
Mechagodzilla
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tuxspeedo wrote:
annie oakley wrote:
This is what they are proposing in Cincinnati.

Image

Now, if they can find a way to fit it in Downtown here, it should be no problem in Columbus. High Street Itself is like Race and Vine put together as far as width is concerned. The street are very narrow down here.



look, I know I'm not the smartest guy in the world or anything, but I'm not a complete idiot, either. would someone, anyone, please explain what the difference is between this thing and a fucking bus? I still haven't heard that.


Dude! See that festive wreath on the front of the train thingy??? think of how nice it will look with all of those broken fiber-optic lights already on High st...That is the difference.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:29 pm 
Godzilla

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PinheadFestival wrote:
What part of "engineering phase" aren't you getting yet? That's exactly what they're determining right now.


The part where they decided they already think it is a good idea, BEFORE they even started the engineering phase.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:30 pm 
Godzilla
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Quote:
Why can’t we just add more buses?
There are two key reasons why adding more buses will not work as well as the streetcar for
circulation: 1-The number of buses required to equal the capacity of one streetcar makes buses
more expensive to operate and maintain, 2 – Examples show that streetcars attract new riders,
people who otherwise would not ride a bus, because of the convenience, comfort, attractiveness
and reliability of the streetcar – thus, the streetcar increases the number of people who will use
transit.


Here are some articles that are pretty good.
http://www.apta.com/research/info/onlin ... ch.cfm#bbt
http://www.cincystreetcar.com/what.html

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:31 pm 
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tuxspeedo wrote:
look, I know I'm not the smartest guy in the world or anything, but I'm not a complete idiot, either. would someone, anyone, please explain what the difference is between this thing and a fucking bus? I still haven't heard that.


Look closer. It's 100% free of dirty people and development follows in its wake.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:36 pm 
King Ghidorah

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bnb614 wrote:
The part where they decided they already think it is a good idea, BEFORE they even started the engineering phase.


Busses aren't hip and don't piss away $100,000,000.


So you wish they'd do the engineering phase...before they did the engineering phase? Huh??? They've been studying the streetcar for years now, they've put a light rail system on the ballot already, they've commissioned and received feasibility studies. All that has already happened, and the links are in this thread.


And exactly how much money do you think buses cost and how much do you think the return is???

OSU ain't tossing 500 grand a year into the number 2 busline.

Unlike COTA, this streetcar is expected to approach a break even point annually...BEFORE you take into consideration the development along the lines, jobs it creates, increase in convention business, etc. etc. etc.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:42 pm 
Godzilla
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Cookie wrote:
tuxspeedo wrote:
look, I know I'm not the smartest guy in the world or anything, but I'm not a complete idiot, either. would someone, anyone, please explain what the difference is between this thing and a fucking bus? I still haven't heard that.


Look closer. It's 100% free of dirty people and development follows in its wake.



Considering they would more than likely be free in Cincinnati, I have a feeling anyone can ride them.

I don't know much about the plan up there, but we'r hyped down here. Not all development is wrapped up in gentrification.
Some people just want to leave their cars at home and get around easily.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:43 pm 
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PinheadFestival wrote:
OSU ain't tossing 500 grand a year into the number 2 busline.


You're right. They're doing that four times a year.

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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:49 pm 
King Ghidorah

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Cookie wrote:
PinheadFestival wrote:
OSU ain't tossing 500 grand a year into the number 2 busline.


You're right. They're doing that four times a year.


I don't believe that's accurate, as my understanding is they are simply charging students for ridership through the University with things like Go Bus and then returning it to COTA.

As opposed to committing to 12.5 million dollars, 500k per year towards the streetcar straight up.

I could be wrong, but that's my understanding. And regardless, even if OSU did give COTA 2 million a year, it doesn't come even close to supporting the line.


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 Post subject: Re: Streetcars
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:53 pm 
King Ghidorah
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Cookie wrote:
Look closer. It's 100% free of dirty people and development follows in its wake.


oh, that was development? I thought it was a car stuck behind it, in it's wake.

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